Starter's Dying---Rebuild or Nippondenso?

[georgesgiralt]

A fully charged battery can lethargically turn the original, un-rebuilt Bosch starter in my '84 R100RT, but not enough energy left to actually start the engine.

Konrad

Hello Konrad,
Maybe there is nothing wrong with the starter. Maybe it is deprived of electricity !
Take a close look at the big wire coming out of the timing chain cover and going to the battery. It is possible that the bar attaching the two sides of the fairing on the frame has eaten a lot of it.
This does not show as the fairing is fiberglass and the frame is well painted so the grounding is very poor but...
On mine, it was less than 25% left of the cable... I have lost my remaining hair thinking I could have put the bike on fire.
If I'm wrong, renewing brushes and the various rings will make your Bosch starter run for 10 years or more. Do not forget to clean the inside to remove all brushes dust. And this will cost you less than a brand new NipponDenso or Chinese Valeo.

[SteveD]

http://www.thisoldtractor.com/gtbender/ ... ir_-bosch-

[ontic]

After a fair bit of research and some conversations, I decided a while ago to to go the chinese Valeo clone path.
A gamble, sure, but it seems like it is paying off for a lot of people.
I had a box of parts gathering at a friends place in Germany, so I got one for the R90 and one for the G/S They were very cheap.
I had to buy a 8 tooth starter drive from Euromotoelectrics to convert the valeo for the R90. I've got the drive, but don't have the starters yet.
The bosch on the R90 is barely working now and will only actually start the bike when it is already hot- cold start requires roll starting. Roll starting aint easy at my new place (FLAT) so the R90 is not currently running and I am bikeless.

I intend to pull apart the chinese valeos before I use them and see if there is any kind of obvious preventative maintenance/mods/improvements that I can do to increase their chances. I'm not sure if the chinese valeo clones have copied the real valeos by using now using clips as well as glue to hold the magnets in place? if they haven't I'll be addressing that, and even if they have I'll be looking at ways to reduce the chance of dropped magnets.

Quite a vitriolic subject at times, the old starter motor issue.

[Chuey]

I like that all of the alternatives are lighter than the Bosch. My Valeos have mostly worked well and I have a Nippon Denso or whatever that expensive one was. It's just grand. The only Valeo I had that didn't work was one I bought with a bunch of electrical components from IBMWR.

Batteries are a similar subject in that we can get everything from tractor batteries (that don't really fit well enough for me to like them) to Odyssey to some new ones that are really small. The Odyssey are either really good or terrible and when one is terrible, it is worse because it cost more. The Odyssey I have that I like best is on my Cafe' Racer and it is the 680, smaller and runs a Valeo and that is a strong starting and robust set-up. The battery holds its charge well, too.

After reading this thread, I'll try one of those Chinese starters if the need comes up.

Chuey

[SteveD]

What is the price and best place to get the Chinese starter?

[ontic]

apparantly you can get them in Australia, though I am not sure where from. Someone on ebay used to sell them I think. Probably other places too. Searching by part numbers might help.
I got mine from Germany- I don't know if it is the best place and I don't know if all chinese Valeo copies are made equal, but this is where I got mine.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll ... 497wt_1142

The price has gone up an exorbitant 1 Euro since I got mine though Like I said, Cheap!
Ignore their list of bwm bike applications. It is a 9 tooth starter- if you need 8, I think you need this part. I hope you need this part because I also bought one...
http://www.euromotoelectrics.com/produc ... rive8t.htm

[SteveD]

apparantly you can get them in Australia, though I am not sure where from. Someone on ebay used to sell them I think. Probably other places too. Searching by part numbers might help.
I got mine from Germany- I don't know if it is the best place and I don't know if all chinese Valeo copies are made equal, but this is where I got mine.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll ... 497wt_1142

The price has gone up an exorbitant 1 Euro since I got mine though Like I said, Cheap!
Ignore their list of bwm bike applications. It is a 9 tooth starter- if you need 8, I think you need this part. I hope you need this part because I also bought one...
http://www.euromotoelectrics.com/produc ... rive8t.htm

Thanks Hans. It says "Not Available to Australia"? Damn cheap though, and with the solenoid going by the picture?

[ontic]

No probs Steve,
and yes, damn cheap.

When I was looking I am pretty sure I found other sellers on German ebay who had similar prices and would ship to Australia. It never hurts to ask them, as often I find they list that sort of thing but can and will ship to Australia anyway..? That seller I linked to were very good and quick in replying to my messages (I was trying to see if they could get that starter in an 8 tooth version)
Just search ebay.de for the part numbers D6RA15 and/or D6RA7. There are quite a few hits. One was the superseded glued in magnets part number, and the other is the updated clipped and glued in magnets part number- usually both listed together now.

[Garnet]

What is the price and best place to get the Chinese starter?

From Merica, but a great guy to deal with, very fast turn around and customs friendly billing.

[Roy Gavin]

EME have them , are great to deal with, and standard USPS is quick and reasonably priced - apparently they make a huge loss every year so our 'American friends subsidise the postage for us. EME also have very reasonably priced HD starter leads which should improve things too

Caltric on Ebay also have them for a little less, but unlike EME I doubt if there would be any effective warranty from them.

My cheapy is still working perfectly after 100.000 km, probably 3000 starts, and it is cranking a high comp 1000 cc motor with the small G/S battery.