My recent project of making a R100CS out of 1983 parts went pretty well. The bike is good looking and rides well. Thing is, it now has a funky starting problem. The battery is an Odessy that was new with the bike (six months old). The starter is a Valeo. When I try to start the bike, it cranks very slowly and doesn't start.
I have put the trickle charger on and the green light flashes, which means very near a full charge. That is the only test I've done with the battery. The starter worked fine when the bike was set up then it sat for a few months and when I tried to start it, sluggish starter.
Where do I start?
Chuey
Reluctant starter
Re: Reluctant starter
Hi Chuey,
I replaced my /6 Bosch starter with one I rebuilt. With 144K miles on it I expected the old starter to be ready for a rebuild. It was in fine shape as it turns out. But, since the engine top was off I replaced it anyway with the rebuilt one.
About 2 months later starting got real balky. Eventually it would not even turn over. The battery was strong and new and I verifed the starter solenoid was working (but replaced it with a new one just because). Still nada.
So off came the rebuilt starter and back on with the old one - vroom! Easy and quick starts.
I took apart the rebuilt one and found the new aft and nose bushings had galled to the steel shaft. It looked as if they had electrical arcing damage and soot. The bushings had actually welded/transfered bronze to the shaft. I replaced the nose bushing and cleaned up the shaft and rear bushing. When I reassembled the starter it worked like a champ.
Not a clue what happened or why.
Teo
I replaced my /6 Bosch starter with one I rebuilt. With 144K miles on it I expected the old starter to be ready for a rebuild. It was in fine shape as it turns out. But, since the engine top was off I replaced it anyway with the rebuilt one.
About 2 months later starting got real balky. Eventually it would not even turn over. The battery was strong and new and I verifed the starter solenoid was working (but replaced it with a new one just because). Still nada.
So off came the rebuilt starter and back on with the old one - vroom! Easy and quick starts.
I took apart the rebuilt one and found the new aft and nose bushings had galled to the steel shaft. It looked as if they had electrical arcing damage and soot. The bushings had actually welded/transfered bronze to the shaft. I replaced the nose bushing and cleaned up the shaft and rear bushing. When I reassembled the starter it worked like a champ.
Not a clue what happened or why.
Teo
Re: Reluctant starter
So maybe I need to try a different starter.
Chuey
Chuey
Re: Reluctant starter
I should also mention that I did the Rob Frankham grounding loom.
Chuey
Chuey
Re: Reluctant starter
Test first, before replacing anything !
Test the starter, the connections, the battery ...
Know what is at fault !
Never a good strategy to simply throw money at the (unknown) problem, eh ?
For what it isn't worth,
anyone can offer their own anecdotal solution – to your problem ...
Test the starter, the connections, the battery ...
Know what is at fault !
Never a good strategy to simply throw money at the (unknown) problem, eh ?
For what it isn't worth,
anyone can offer their own anecdotal solution – to your problem ...
Re: Reluctant starter
Will a battery from one of your other bikes fit the cafe? Swap over a good battery, then a known good starter. Or take the battery in to a shop that has a real load tester. You need at least 200 CCA, although I have run old batteries that tested less than 150 (with a kicker back up).
Do this after cleaning all the cables.
Do this after cleaning all the cables.
Garnet
Re: Reluctant starter
Grounding may be going from the starter armature to the flywheel by way of the bushings rather than through the case causing the arcing. Make sure the starter case has a good ground.teo wrote:Hi Chuey,
I replaced my /6 Bosch starter with one I rebuilt. With 144K miles on it I expected the old starter to be ready for a rebuild. It was in fine shape as it turns out. But, since the engine top was off I replaced it anyway with the rebuilt one.
About 2 months later starting got real balky. Eventually it would not even turn over. The battery was strong and new and I verifed the starter solenoid was working (but replaced it with a new one just because). Still nada.
So off came the rebuilt starter and back on with the old one - vroom! Easy and quick starts.
I took apart the rebuilt one and found the new aft and nose bushings had galled to the steel shaft. It looked as if they had electrical arcing damage and soot. The bushings had actually welded/transfered bronze to the shaft. I replaced the nose bushing and cleaned up the shaft and rear bushing. When I reassembled the starter it worked like a champ.
Not a clue what happened or why.
Teo
Re: Reluctant starter
I have had two Oddessys and the both failed the same way, no warning, good volts, charger indicates full charge yet they just die under load, suddenly an inexplicably.
If yours is gone try a Motobatt - no fancy super high CCA claims, just a verifiable 25% more, but they maintain almost full voltage while cranking which helps starting, and they hold more power than the rest, so they will crank for longer if need be.
My local bike guy now sells nothing else, and claims they are the first battery ever that he gets no warrenty claims on.
If yours is gone try a Motobatt - no fancy super high CCA claims, just a verifiable 25% more, but they maintain almost full voltage while cranking which helps starting, and they hold more power than the rest, so they will crank for longer if need be.
My local bike guy now sells nothing else, and claims they are the first battery ever that he gets no warrenty claims on.
Adelaide, Oz. 77 R75/7. 86 R80 G/S PD, 93 R100 GS, 70 BSA B44 VS ,BMW F650 Classic
Re: Reluctant starter
Fore and aft bronze bushings are easy to check, cheap, and easy to replace.
I've spent most of my money on women, motorcycles, and beer.
The rest of it I just wasted.
The rest of it I just wasted.
Re: Reluctant starter
Thanks, all. I think the battery is the first thing I'll test by replacing it. I can use one from another bike, costs only time. Same with the starter. I'm not savvy enough about electrical principles to know how to test things. All connections are very good. Freshly built bike and I was very cognizant of electrical connections, etc.
Chuey
Chuey